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 Post subject: Re: Observations on WM/FSUW Marriage Failures
Post Number:#11  PostPosted: 05 Feb 2011 16:18 
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Shadow wrote:
Ecocks wrote:
I don't say the European folks don't have some of the same problems, just that culture and distance make the same problems a bit more severe. You have advantages with regard to sorter travel times, the "European feel" to some of your cities, better developed mass transit and somewhat larger communities in a smaller geographical area.

Enough explanation ?

Yes it is.
[thanks.gif] for taking the time to explain.

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 Post subject: Re: Observations on WM/FSUW Marriage Failures
Post Number:#12  PostPosted: 05 Feb 2011 21:43 
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[welcome1.gif] It was easy to miss...

Regarding the larger communities in a smaller region, in Holland and Belgium this is an optical illusion. While there is very little space untouched by gumans, the actual numbers are much lower in comparison to cities elsewhere.

The Hague, where I was born, has around 600.000 residents, when comparing that to the FSU you will look at something that might be called a town. My current residence is in a village of 4.000, which in the FSU would probably not have paved roads. Here just nobody has thought of making sidewalks..

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 Post subject: Re: Observations on WM/FSUW Marriage Failures
Post Number:#13  PostPosted: 07 Feb 2011 18:18 
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Personal observations in line with the original post

  1. Poor English skills - I totally agree with you that Russian women who speak very little or no English at all that they don't understand how important it is to have good (verbal) communication. Like you said: "they don't really understand the magnitude of learning a language (on their own) and vastly overestimate their abilities" Many men too, don't pay much attention to this and hope, like their women, that it will take short time for them to be able to learn to speak English and communicate effectively. Learning a second language and becoming able to communicate effectively takes very long time and I know that from personal experience, especially at an older age. I would have never married a Russian woman who was not able to speak good basic English. I have also made sure that my wife understood how important it's for her to communicate well, which will make her feel comfortable in her new life and environment!

  2. Lack of Driving - The town we live has just over 6000 population with plenty of amenities and shops. Another town is just 4 miles away with similar population, the capital of the county Guilford with 67000 population, is just 15 minutes drive and London only 45 minutes away by car and train. My wife, coming from a city with over 1 million people, thinks our town is just a quiet village, but with time grew to like it and enjoy its peaceful location! [biggrin.gif]

    I am retired so my wife has no need to worry for transport to go to work or shopping as I am always available to drive her around. We also have regular bus service to nearby larger towns and direct train service too and also to London. She is now studying to learn how to drive.... and we hope soon she will be able to take the theory test. While learning the theory for her driving test her vocabulary is improving too!


  3. Russian Friends, Foods and TV - We don't have any Russian women or mixed married couples nearby so I did not have to worry about it. I introduced her to all our English neighbors, my personal friends and family during her learning carve of English and she has no problem chatting away with them, made sure we watch only British films and TV programs, , listen to local or BBC news radio and now she feels very comfortable with her abilities to understand nearly everything.

    I know that my English is not perfect but I do always correct her mistakes and she doesn't mind me doing so. Working daily and mixing with many type of different people has given her confidence back and as I said previously she is comfortable taking written tests for her new professional job. All in all my wife has made very good progress but there is a long way till she is completely fluent in English.


  4. Isolation - Mama, sister and friends are a long way off but I have overcome this problem by making sure she can talk to mama on Camera and to others by phone, (I have installed a free internet connection). That way my wife doesn't feel cut off from her family and at the same time we keep Babushka happy too.

    Unfortunately earlier she used these facilities on a daily basis, which inhibited her progress but now has cut down the frequency talking to all of them. I am always around so she has not suffered from loneness or isolation and I do not agree with your comment that:"Skype is a poor substitute for a mother's hug or a son's wave as they go to work that morning." because our wive's are not children, we all had to fly the nest. On the other hand, thanks to our luck, we have modern and fast communications and our modern babushka is always with us, even when we have Christmas lunch! [biggrin.gif] She is always kept up to date with our life and news and "Ria Novosti", as I call her, keeps reporting everything from over there. Camera conference is a Big help and made a great difference to our life! [happy.gif]


  5. Lifestyle - We may live in "a small village", (wife says) but we are only 20 minutes from Gatwick and 40 minutes from Heathrow and frequently take advantage of cheap flights and holidays to visit various places in Europe.
    During our 2 1/2 married life, we have been lucky and have managed to take several short breaks and longer holidays, also visited Russia too and I think we have managed to avoid boredom of the daily life. Weather in the UK is very unpredictable but manged to visit several place here too. I hope we can continue doing it for long time as it does makes a lot of difference to our relationship!


  6. Building a Relationship - Yes, it's a long way to Russia and Ukraine for American's or OZ & AZ people but for Europeans it's much closer and costs less.

    I agree with your comment: "Deciding you found "the one" and sweeping all the concerns and problems under the rug thinking, "Love will find a way to persevere." rarely seems to work".

    Taking the woman on holiday just make for happy memories, and if you want to get to know each other well then you must spent lot of time in her environment and also at your own place, if the visa restrictions permit but using high risk tactics and making decisions after 1 or 2 meetings, like many of the American's do, due to time and financial considerations, applying for a K1 visa doesn't give enough time for success.

  7. Communication - Any marriage counsellor will tell you that one of the main reasons why couples break up is their inability to communicate well with each other. Regardless of whether or not a conversation might be about shared personal issues, what's happening at work, mutual interests, or the state of world affairs, couples need to find time to talk with each other.

    Of course due to her working and me been retired we have plenty of free time away from each other during the day. I am not one to look for the television remote control as I am at home most of the day listening to rolling news and also music and reading papers through the internet.

    It's more important that I put her first and share a few moments together. If that means sitting down to cuddle on the sofa and just sharing whatever is on our mind, telling her what is going on on the boards, (she likes to know... the latest....) [wink.gif] ........then so be it.

    It's called "communication" and it is indeed the glue that keeps the "relate" in ours and other couples relationships.

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 Post subject: Re: Observations on WM/FSUW Marriage Failures
Post Number:#14  PostPosted: 16 Feb 2011 12:10 
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I can finally 'counter' a lot of the thing I disagree with that Ed and Wiz would have members 'believe'

*I* think that 'dictating' to one's wife who she should meet ( avoif folk speaking her language) and 'suggesting' no Ru/ UA language TV makes the man come across 'cave man' ..

One's wife can decide who to make friends wife and who's advice to seek .. grant her a little gumption....

I like watching some RU lang TV and have a 'good laugh' at comparing ( say) CNN, euronew, BBC and Vesti's reporting of the same thing..


Sure we can / you will fall out, as we 'adjust' and we still do... but for two guys who've lived in another country I find their opinion 'interesting ' - especially as one of 'em 'regrets' not being conversational in her tongue.

Ed, is SPOT ON with his opinion that the lady should WANT to learn English- if she is serious about coming to live in an English speaking country ..


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 Post subject: Re: Observations on WM/FSUW Marriage Failures
Post Number:#15  PostPosted: 16 Feb 2011 13:13 
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msmobyru wrote:
I can finally 'counter' a lot of the thing I disagree with that Ed and Wiz would have members 'believe'

  1. *I* think that 'dictating' to one's wife who she should meet ( avoif folk speaking her language) and 'suggesting' no Ru/ UA language TV makes the man come across 'cave man' ..
  2. One's wife can decide who to make friends wife and who's advice to seek .. grant her a little gumption....
  3. I like watching some RU lang TV and have a 'good laugh' at comparing ( say) CNN, euronew, BBC and Vesti's reporting of the same thing..
  4. Sure we can / you will fall out, as we 'adjust' and we still do... but for two guys who've lived in another country I find their opinion 'interesting ' - especially as one of 'em 'regrets' not being conversational in her tongue.
  5. Ed, is SPOT ON with his opinion that the lady should WANT to learn English- if she is serious about coming to live in an English speaking country ..

  1. I never dictated to my wife who should she meet but she made her own decision that she doesn't want to watch Russian TV and she had no problem watching British TV, when she came over because she wanted to improve her English and become fluent!
  2. Sorry but we always make common decisions!
  3. I watch RT in English in the early mornings.... while she is a sleep.... but then she goes to work! In the evening...... refer you to my previous answer.
  4. don't understand your comments.
  5. If my wife had no intention for improving her English..... our relationship would have gone nowhere! What Ed said is obviously a precondition to any mixed relationship. How else she would feel comfortable and integrate to the local society?

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 Post subject: Re: Observations on WM/FSUW Marriage Failures
Post Number:#16  PostPosted: 16 Feb 2011 13:41 
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I had Russian TV for the first month Mila and Kirill were here. I found they didn't watch it at all...and that I was the one watching it to see what strange crap I found there. Just curiousity. So that was short lived.

What we do do is watch Russian films on occasion. Especially if we can find them with English subtitles. Gives me some insite into Russian culture and films and brings us as a family closer together. Nothing like sharing an old favourite film with someone to see it through a new person's eye. Mile enjoyed sharing fondly remembered films from her past with me like Adventures of Italians in Russia. Diamond Arm. Etc.

Which reminds me...I have to go find a copy of Russian Hunt or whatever that movie is called next.


Last edited by froid on 16 Feb 2011 14:08, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Observations on WM/FSUW Marriage Failures
Post Number:#17  PostPosted: 16 Feb 2011 14:17 
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When I was in Tashkent I git a few laughs out of the TV comedy, 'University.' Another interesting one was the copycat TV show 'Married with Children.' The Rusian version is called ,'Happy Together.' I sat there filming it to show some friends back home.

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 Post subject: Re: Observations on WM/FSUW Marriage Failures
Post Number:#18  PostPosted: 17 Feb 2011 01:03 
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msmobyru wrote:
I can finally 'counter' a lot of the thing I disagree with that Ed and Wiz would have members 'believe'

*I* think that 'dictating' to one's wife who she should meet ( avoif folk speaking her language) and 'suggesting' no Ru/ UA language TV makes the man come across 'cave man' ..

One's wife can decide who to make friends wife and who's advice to seek .. grant her a little gumption....


Moby,

I don't see anything in the comments about hindering your wife in finding Russian speaking friends, but instead don't push her to make them (e.g. drive her down to the Russian orthodox church just to meet other Russians). Based on what I learned from a few FSUW I dated locally, there are more than a few Russian speakers that are best to be avoided, so let the wife screen them in her own manner instead of hoisting them on her (which is what I think Ed and Wiz were saying).


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 Post subject: Re: Observations on WM/FSUW Marriage Failures
Post Number:#19  PostPosted: 17 Feb 2011 06:50 
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Hi 'wicheese'

Re the ( her language) 'friends'.. *I* think it's a good idea to introduce your lady to folk who know the ropes and let her disseminate.

When Veta started English lessons the wonderful lady in charge of the dept. went out of her way to look up former RU speakers and got THEM to contact Veta...

They were all very kind and helpful and it was a positive step - it helped her understand 'the ropes' more quickly and in no way has it been a 'crutch' or impediment to her integration / settling - QUITE the opposite.


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 Post subject: Re: Observations on WM/FSUW Marriage Failures
Post Number:#20  PostPosted: 03 Apr 2011 10:15 
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Sharing responsibilities and sacrifices

Perhaps it would help if the darling husband when he is still the darling fiancé warned his future wife before she even moves to be with him that life as an immigrant will not be easy. He should tell a woman he is dating that she can expect a culture shock and she will likely shed a lot tears, frustration in finding a job, more tears, frustration when finding a job and being stressed by co-workers, more tears, frustration as she strives to upgrade her skills and even more tears....

If men were to paint a realistic picture of what kind of life she can expect, tell her that he will expect that she will work very hard to overcome many problems on her own. Once he has honestly told her what to expect, then he should ask her whether she is still willing to marry him.

If she says yes, he should also ask her why she would be crazy enough to do such a thing?

The only correct answer IMHO is that she understands the difficulties that await her, but that she is willing to do it because she loves him.

Bear in mind that the poor little soul is away from family and friends so he must go the extra mile, particularly if her language is not great. The trap is right there in the very fact she is foreign. You're right (IMO), it is not culturally Russian, it is BECAUSE she is Russian or in other words foreign and needs more than a local might.

Well why I say all that?

It's because of my personal experience and what I had to go through as an immigrant to a foreign country, when I first came to the UK.

In general, English people are not very welcoming [sarcastic.gif]



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